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A place for you to post comments on our articles.
74

GreenCine Daily
Topic by: dwhudson
Posted: May 16, 2003 - 2:06 PM PDT
Last Reply: November 15, 2003 - 9:04 AM PST

author topic: GreenCine Daily
dwhudson
post #1  on May 16, 2003 - 2:06 PM PDT  
For the purposes of discussing anything we've spotted at GC's blog that makes us want to blow off steam, snicker out loud or just hang around with a bunch of other people who might have spotted the same thing.
dpowers
post #2  on May 17, 2003 - 11:29 AM PDT  
this is different from leaving comments on the blog...?
dpowers
post #3  on May 17, 2003 - 11:30 AM PDT  
well yeah duh of course it is but, it's sort of textural, huh.
dwhudson
post #4  on May 17, 2003 - 12:28 PM PDT  
Yep, it's different. No idea in what way yet, though. Let's see what happens.

Well, actually, I do have an idea. Already at the blog, there's a comment from a non-GCer (and he's only a non-GCer because he lives in the UK [g]). This topic's situated in a forum accessible to GCers only; the comments (spread out over each entry, whereas this forum is always right here, in one place, with all its topics stacked up neatly right next to each other) are open to anyone and everyone.

It'll be interesting to see what different sorts of conversations evolve given such different circumstances.
dpowers
post #5  on June 4, 2003 - 4:14 PM PDT  
the mind is not coming back here. the text isn't crossing the border from published to quoted, where there is room to discuss it.

i wonder if there is a way to tie this thread or perhaps a whole "forum" to greencine daily, so that the comments there would be stored, displayed, and listed here as a thread. you know like, if someone posted a comment, it would create a thread on GC's boards:

message 1: original article
message 2: comment #1
message 3: comment #2
message 4: message board post ("comment #3" on GC daily, or not)

that would be nice. very nice!

if this involves a "GreenCine Daily" forum, then a new topic would be generated using the clever title of the GCD post the user was commenting on. insert the article, insert the comment, insert further comments based on a stored link to the topic on the boards. would this be a ton of work?
dwhudson
post #6  on June 5, 2003 - 11:44 AM PDT  
> would this be a ton of work?

I hate to leave this question hanging, David, but I just don't know. That is, if you're talking about some sort of technical solution, an automatic feed.

If, on the other hand, you're talking about a manual, cut-n-paste operation, well, I guess that would depend on how busy it actually gets over there. If things stay pretty much the way they are now - lots of readers, few commentators - I suppose that'd be doable.
dpowers
post #7  on June 5, 2003 - 5:07 PM PDT  
no i was talking about it being automatic. cut and paste would work too, wouldn't it, though, except it would feel like stealing time from somebody (who might have other obligations such as family, paying job, new home).

i'm definitely a happy reader of greencine daily. definitely. reading it every day, following links, writing comments. the longer format suits the material, too, i think, the same way i liked the headline-brevity of the "above the fold" news items on the GC main page.

here's what i think. having the "daily 5" and various user-submitted materials alongside a dense paragraph or two of tidbit-gathering was a good blend. the news made the daily 5 sparkle, the user area showed the news to have an audience (which, as you are reading, is quite cool!), you see what i'm saying.

before the web, when you built a user environment, you were doing it inside of one piece of software. new windows were obviously children because you never left the space. the web is different. a new window is a new space, even design elements can't glue them together, there has to really be an integration of data, of flow of thought. click to return is the simplest but click to make this point your new center of perspective, keeping everything still attached, is an ideal, right?

anyway.
dwhudson
post #8  on June 6, 2003 - 9:58 AM PDT  

> no i was talking about it being automatic. cut and paste would work too, wouldn't it, though, except it would feel like stealing time from somebody (who might have other obligations such as family, paying job, new home).

You're too kind. [g] But since you're talking automatic, then I'm afraid I have to fall back on my original reply: I don't know. But I would guess that there are other things in the pipeline that would take priority. I'm just saying. So false hopes aren't raised and all.

> i'm definitely a happy reader of greencine daily. definitely. reading it every day, following links, writing comments.

Very much appreciated!

> here's what i think. having the "daily 5" and various user-submitted materials alongside a dense paragraph or two of tidbit-gathering was a good blend. the news made the daily 5 sparkle, the user area showed the news to have an audience (which, as you are reading, is quite cool!), you see what i'm saying.

I do. But I also think:

-- These things take time. GC Daily is indeed doing what it's supposed to do. Besides the things you've already mentioned, it is slowly, by osmosis, seeping out into the world. Every day - no exaggeration - every day since 'going public' with it, I'm in touch with someone who's discovered it, one way or the other, someone who didn't know about GreenCine before. That's not really the point you're addressing, I know, but the arrangement we all grew comfortable with over a period of a few months there, wth the news on the homepage here, was great for us 'inside the system' but for no one else. There was no osmosis going on.

-- I'm reminded of other changes, most of them redesigns, that take getting used to. Back when Salon was a lot more popular (or maybe I should say, was a bigger presence on the Web, relatively, than it is now), two redesigns, separated by years, raised an incredible ruckus and protest. "Why fix something that's not broken?" and so on. I felt that way, too. But in retrospect, the redesign in the middle, i.e., the version of the site before the current one, was, IMHO, the best they ever had going. Same thing when Jim Romanesko's media blog was redesigned by Poynter -- people upset about a blog redesign! wonderful -- but when Howell Raines went, all the media folk when to Romanesko. They're over it, and in fact, probably used to the current version so much that they'd be jolted if Romanesko were to go back to the original. Or, to take up this example...

> before the web, when you built a user environment, you were doing it inside of one piece of software. new windows were obviously children because you never left the space. the web is different. a new window is a new space, even design elements can't glue them together, there has to really be an integration of data, of flow of thought. click to return is the simplest but click to make this point your new center of perspective, keeping everything still attached, is an ideal, right?

... reminds me of the Well. The original Well-Beings swore by Picospan, the plain text quirky software they grew to love for all its faults. Along came Well Engaged, a way into the system via a Web browser. For years, Engaged users were sneered at and looked down upon. But as time progressed, and the interface, etc., with it, even some diehards realized that there were aspects about using Engaged that were more convenient in a world dominated by the Web by this point. Clickable links and so forth.

I'm blathering, but all in all, I'd say: It's early yet. Let's give this time and see what feels like home in another month or two.
dpowers
post #9  on June 6, 2003 - 1:04 PM PDT  
hmm, hmmm. i like movies, i like message boards and i like online neighborhoods that are grounded in something, and that means, i like GC, a lot.

i know there are tons of people in san francisco (sorry can't say about berlin ^_^) who are good at doing the techie and people work to make something like GC last a while, and the people at eline and greencine are as skilled and fun as anybody i've met. in these tough and strange times you guys are doing a great job! (i say strange because online stuff is definitely "the future" but no longer "the bright, shiny future," so, what expectations to have?)

> GC Daily is indeed doing what it's supposed to do. Besides the things you've already mentioned, it is slowly, by osmosis, seeping out into the world. <

no i knew this already; the reason was there in past mentions of the LOTR article hit rates and it's visible in the design of the blog page; the success i think shows in the new writing style. this is good!!!

> I'm reminded of other changes, most of them redesigns, that take getting used to. <

i'm an ordinary user of the service, but believe it or not, i have a goal, too, so, if there's something i need to get used to, there is also something that i want, which i think is safe to describe because you and everbody are "pros" at this stuff...

what i want is for these message boards to be a driving, inspiring aspect of subscribing to greencine. something that pulls together all the editorial material and all the structured user material (lists, reviews, ratings, queue) and makes them dance. UGNA was a kludge, a cheat, toward bringing more info into the boards, for dissection and dissemination, to fertilize the whole GC environment for both posters and lurkers.

like i wrote before, i have this idea about every point of view being rich, useful. from the perspective of the boards, the news is sort of gone, out of view, which is a shame because the digging around that you and craig and others who contribute have done is a beautiful thing, unmatched on the site, that can enlighten, enliven, etc. i want to be able to "see" it from "here"!

> "Why fix something that's not broken?" and so on. I felt that way, too. But in retrospect, the redesign in the middle, i.e., the version of the site before the current one, was, IMHO, the best they ever had going. <

i know i know people can be so cranky about stuff! but that's because they're using it. if somebody came in and rearranged your kitchen you'd probably get mad too...

> Let's give this time and see what feels like home in another month or two. <

kay.

plus the boards are going to change a lot in that time, that's obvious.
dwhudson
post #10  on June 6, 2003 - 1:22 PM PDT  
> UGNA was a kludge, a cheat, toward bringing more info into the boards, for dissection and dissemination, to fertilize the whole GC environment for both posters and lurkers.

Suddenly, it hits me what you may have been driving at all along. Basically, a revival/continuation of UGNA in some form or other.

And then I realized... like I was shot... Like I was shot with a diamond... a diamond bullet right through my forehead... And I thought: My God... the genius of that. The genius. The will to do that. Perfect, genuine, complete, crystalline, pure.

Oh.

Sorry, I must've been channeling again.

No, really: This would, of course, be as easy to do as UGNA ever was. Just another step, cut-n-paste the day's GC Daily entry/entries into an UGNA-like topic.

I can see the advantage. But there's also something about it that bugs me, and I'm not quite sure what it is. It's not that the UGNA topic, which was terrific legacy-wise, wasn't a particularly active topic. Something else. But...

But ok, the idea's out there; anyone else with thoughts about it one way or the other? Would you want something like this here again?
wdrazo
post #11  on June 6, 2003 - 8:32 PM PDT  
I'm not sure why, but I would say yes. Yet I feel this duplicates effort. GCD is great...I just wish I had more time to read it.
msilenus
post #12  on June 17, 2003 - 8:35 AM PDT  
I just went to Greencine Daily and saw about the letter from the Iranian about the arrest of the "filmi" . I have a friend online who lives in Iran and he told me about when this guy got arrested. It was the only way he could see European and American movies. Now he has nobody to supply these bootlegs. I dont know what should happen in that country but the time for some progressive rights is definitely at hand.-MS
msilenus
post #13  on September 15, 2003 - 9:11 AM PDT  
Hi everyone....I was just wondering about this Screen Daily website...is there a way to subscribe for free or is it only paid subscribers that can access the site? I keep clicking on links in Greencine Daily for the articles on this website and all I ever get is the Subscribers Only message.-MS
hamano
post #14  on October 30, 2003 - 11:11 AM PST  
I wanted to add this as a "comment" but the comment window wouldn't open external links in new windows.

RE Ozu retrospective

Hmmm.... not much actual info about Ozu, one of my favorite directors. Like France's Eric Rohmer, he seems to be documenting a slice of everyday life, then remaking that film over and over again. I think reading about some of the methods he established over his career will enrich a viewer's appreciation...

IMDB Ozu page with filmography
A comprehensive Ozu fansite
An essential article there about Ozu's very distinct camera style
An interesting article comparing Ozu's use of space to the work of "Beat" Takeshi Kitano
A Cinespot article discusses Ozu's stylistic use of ellipsis
underdog
post #15  on October 30, 2003 - 4:08 PM PST  
> On September 15, 2003 - 9:11 AM PDT msilenus wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> Hi everyone....I was just wondering about this Screen Daily website...is there a way to subscribe for free or is it only paid subscribers that can access the site? I keep clicking on links in Greencine Daily for the articles on this website and all I ever get is the Subscribers Only message.-MS
> ---------------------------------


Hey MS, sorry for delay in responding to this! We hadn't realized ScreenDaily had become a premium site. I notified David about this and we will try not to link to them in the future. It's frustrating, but the nature of the business I guess. Sorry 'bout that.

Also, Hamano, yes one of the few flaws with Moveable Type is that the comments field doesn't allow for HTML code hyperlinks, alas. So thanks for reposting that.

Craig@greencine.com
Associate Editor
dwhudson
post #16  on October 31, 2003 - 7:51 AM PST  
Yes, just to add to what Craig said, what seems to be going on is this: The reviews actually are available to non-subscribers (like me, too), but only for a while. I've been thinking, since I could see them soon after they send out their newsletter, that everything's been behind a subscriber-only wall except for the reviews. But evidently, they are, too, after a day or so.

Sorry! Won't happen again.
dwhudson
post #17  on October 31, 2003 - 7:54 AM PST  

> I wanted to add this as a "comment" but the comment window wouldn't open external links in new windows.

Ja, sorry about that, too, hamano. Most people just create links in the comments like you've done here; I think there's an option to change the settings to automatically generate links from URLs... I'll look.
hamano
post #18  on November 14, 2003 - 10:28 AM PST  
I love the guardian panel! Lynch AND Cronenberg AND Miyazaki in the Top Ten?!? Wow.

Some faulty arithmetic, though.

"18 Americans in all, nearly half the bunch. Represented by two directors are Taiwan, Japan, Iran and the UK. One each: Hong Kong, Brazil (Walter Salles, the only Latin American), Canada, Russia, France, Spain, Poland, Hungary, Denmark, Austria, Finland and Sweden."

That adds up to just 38. One mistake that I noticed right away is that Miyazaki, Kitano and Miike are 3 Japanese directors. So who's missing? Your puzzle for today, GreenCiners!
dwhudson
post #19  on November 15, 2003 - 7:09 AM PST  

> That adds up to just 38. One mistake that I noticed right away is that Miyazaki, Kitano and Miike are 3 Japanese directors. So who's missing? Your puzzle for today, GreenCiners!
> ---------------------------------

D'oh! Good grief. I should've thought of adding up the results to double check. Thanks for catching that. So, you're right: One of the missing is the third Japanese director. The second is the third from the UK: Davies, Ramsay and Winterbottom. Makes 3, not 2.

hamano
post #20  on November 15, 2003 - 9:04 AM PST  
> On November 15, 2003 - 7:09 AM PDT dwhudson wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> D'oh! Good grief. I should've thought of adding up the results to double check. Thanks for catching that. So, you're right: One of the missing is the third Japanese director. The second is the third from the UK: Davies, Ramsay and Winterbottom. Makes 3, not 2.
> ---------------------------------

Awww... it's no fun if you find the missing director, DW! I was hoping to send AKrizman or Cinenaut into an obsessive fit of researching directors' countries of origin. I suspected the missing man was British, but I wasn't gonna sweat it myself.

Catching this kind of error is an unfortunate byproduct of having a daughter in second grade. I'm in charge of reviewing her homework. underdog, the correct spelling is r-e-s-i-s-t-a-n-t, not r-e-s-i-s-t-e-n-t! Use spellcheck!

At least you know I'm reading these articles! ^_^

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