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1064

Van Nuys vs San Jose?
Topic by: FGaipa
Posted: July 21, 2007 - 12:21 PM PDT
Last Reply: July 25, 2007 - 11:08 PM PDT

author topic: Van Nuys vs San Jose?
FGaipa
post #1  on July 21, 2007 - 12:21 PM PDT  
Conceivably this shift could benefit a majority of subscribers. But for Bay Area members it can only result in a substantial decline in service. I work for the USPS in Oakland. Figure two days each direction if you're very very lucky, up to a week either way if you're not. Consider also the likely responsiveness of underpaid processing center workers and managers at several hundred miles remove from their SF-based client. The fact, too often repeated in the throttling thread, that the new group handles a number of mail clients is not a plus. If you've been watching six or seven a week on a four-out, forget it.

I've never tried Netflix, and wonder whether anyone can tell me here whether they really do still throttle and whether they might be a better source for our red, orange, and yellows. The fact that they mail and receive from San Jose, and that the Post Office treats them with kid gloves, special holdouts and signage, the works, suddenly looks relevant.

fg
FGaipa
post #2  on July 21, 2007 - 12:39 PM PDT  
Post Script -- I wonder what proportion of GC's members are in the Bay Area or nearby. If it's half, a third, or even a quarter, then doesn't the shift constitute de facto throttling?

fg
woozy
post #3  on July 21, 2007 - 1:52 PM PDT  
Well, I live in Berkeley and have been a member of NF for ... five years? I guess.

To be perfectly honest, NF does throttle and I find it a bit of a petty and dihonest police (then again I consider "no late fees" to be a dishonest statement; if you are only allowed n-disks at a time you are still paying be the day-disk which is absolutely no different), but it practically doesn't make much of difference. When I was on the three out plan, I'd recieve a disk on weekday 1, watch it weeknight 1, mail it back weekday 2. They'd recieved it weekday 3 and send it weekday 3, and I'd recieve it weekday 4. Three day turnaround which is about as fast as you can do assuming you allow one day to actually watch the the thing. So far as I know, I was never throttled on the three out plan. On the five out plan I was throttled a few times. If I mailed the disks back the very next day consistantly, they'd slow down about two (20%) of my disks to a four day rather than three way turnaround. Lately I've been keeping the disks a bit longer (I can only watch so much) and they don't throttle.

Netflix now admits they throttle but have another term for it. I don't think they should use the term "unlimitted" as it quite definitely isn't. Many people don't have a problem with throttling if they are upfront about it.

My observations:

1)NF in San Jose and NF in San Francisco both have consistant 1-day in-mail one-way time.
2)GC ships on Saturday (will they continue to do so?) which means if you mail on Fri. you will (assuming same day ship and two one-day mailings) recieve the next disk on Mon but with NF (same assumtions) Tues.
3) The more n-out you have with NetFlix the more likely they are to throttle you out of a three day turnaround.

If you work at home, have independant views about pirating laws and obligations to obey laws you may not agree with, live in the Bay Area, and have a DVD ripper, you can recieve GC disks in the morning, rip 'em, and mail them in the afternoon and have a two day turn around. NF will throttle you for sure.

If you watch your disks the day you get them and mail them the next day, and have the three out plan, you can do three day turnaround with both NF and GC but as GC mails on saturday you can 6/week but with NF it be 5/week (on average of course). With four or more out you can do 8/week with GC if you *really* watch them all immediately. With NF you could do 6 2/3 but NF would probably throttle this down to 6 1/2. 5 out you can do 10/week with GC and with NF 8 1/5 but they'd throttle it down to 7.

Then again, who the heck can consistantly watch a movie immediately on the day it was recieved. In practicality throttling doesn't really make a big deal.

Honestly, in terms of economic and practical efficiency, NetFlix is probably a better choice.

But with GC you feel good and you can chat with Bowwow, and IronS, and AFleming, and SinisterGuffaw, and .... well, there's still Battie and artifex at least. Oh, yeah, there's still that hamano guy too.
FGaipa
post #4  on July 21, 2007 - 2:25 PM PDT  
Woozy's comparisons help, but don't take into account the likely four-day round trip to Van Nuys.

fg
woozy
post #5  on July 21, 2007 - 3:08 PM PDT  
> On July 21, 2007 - 2:25 PM PDT FGaipa wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> Woozy's comparisons help, but don't take into account the likely four-day round trip to Van Nuys.
>
> fg
> ---------------------------------

I was doing the GC of old. Umm, Is GC moving to Van Nuys? To San Jose? I don't know the inner workings of the Post Office, which you probably do. I'm actually kind of surprised how well Northern Cal to Northern Cal is so consistantly one day.

So how long does a letter from L.A. take to get to SF? If it's more than one day then there is no question that Netflix will be faster for us east bay folks.

Netflix *does* throttle but not enough to turn a three day turnaround to five days.

Not to stand in the lobby of Mom and Pop's books and fair trade organic coffee and *gush* about how wonderful Barnes and Noble and Starbucks are, but I was recently vacationing in Alaska (Thanks for noticing I was gone folks! >:| ) and out of curiosity I dropped off NF disk. They sent the next the next day (I assume my disk went to a center in Alaska). Kinda impressive. Then again I also dropped off a GC disc on a Saturday (possibly after the mail went out) and GC mailed the replacement on Thurs. Not tooooo bad considering the distance. Well, I guess that's not really good at all but it's about as good as one can expect in Sterling, Alaska...
doozer
post #6  on July 21, 2007 - 3:43 PM PDT  
> On July 21, 2007 - 3:08 PM PDT woozy wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> > On July 21, 2007 - 2:25 PM PDT FGaipa wrote:
> > ---------------------------------
> > Woozy's comparisons help, but don't take into account the likely four-day round trip to Van Nuys.
> >
> > fg
> > ---------------------------------
>
> I was doing the GC of old. Umm, Is GC moving to Van Nuys? To San Jose? I don't know the inner workings of the Post Office, which you probably do. I'm actually kind of surprised how well Northern Cal to Northern Cal is so consistantly one day.
>
> So how long does a letter from L.A. take to get to SF? If it's more than one day then there is no question that Netflix will be faster for us east bay folks.
>


I live in Los Angeles and when I send or receive mail to SF it never takes more than a day. I don't do it often, but that's my personal experience.

woozy
post #7  on July 21, 2007 - 4:09 PM PDT  
> On July 21, 2007 - 3:43 PM PDT doozer wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> I live in Los Angeles and when I send or receive mail to SF it never takes more than a day. I don't do it often, but that's my personal experience.
>
First "weezy" and now "doozer". Um, am I being stalked?

doozer, you are a GC member. How long does it take you to send and get your disks to and from GC?

Um, why are we assuming the GC distr. center is moving to Van Nuys?
artifex
post #8  on July 21, 2007 - 4:33 PM PDT  
> On July 21, 2007 - 4:09 PM PDT woozy wrote:
> Um, why are we assuming the GC distr. center is moving to Van Nuys?

I think it was mentioned in that really big thread where I had to get technical.

I think an ameliorating factor in the move would be that the Van Nuys people are obviously not going to be brand new at handling lots of discs, because CBT's shipping facility has been there a while. Let's just wait and see.
woozy
post #9  on July 21, 2007 - 4:53 PM PDT  
> On July 21, 2007 - 4:33 PM PDT artifex wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> > On July 21, 2007 - 4:09 PM PDT woozy wrote:
> > Um, why are we assuming the GC distr. center is moving to Van Nuys?
>
> I think it was mentioned in that really big thread where I had to get technical.
>
You mean in one of the deleted messages? I searched Van Nuys in the discussion and didn't find anything.
doozer
post #10  on July 21, 2007 - 5:23 PM PDT  
> On July 21, 2007 - 4:09 PM PDT woozy wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> > On July 21, 2007 - 3:43 PM PDT doozer wrote:
> > ---------------------------------
> > I live in Los Angeles and when I send or receive mail to SF it never takes more than a day. I don't do it often, but that's my personal experience.
> >
> First "weezy" and now "doozer". Um, am I being stalked?
>

You're just so pretty, I can't help myself.

> doozer, you are a GC member. How long does it take you to send and get your disks to and from GC?

I am brand spankin new to GC (put on some pants folks, there's a new kid about) so I cannot answer that question.
toastandkeri
post #11  on July 21, 2007 - 6:12 PM PDT  
> On July 21, 2007 - 4:53 PM PDT woozy wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> > On July 21, 2007 - 4:33 PM PDT artifex wrote:
> > ---------------------------------
> > > On July 21, 2007 - 4:09 PM PDT woozy wrote:
> > > Um, why are we assuming the GC distr. center is moving to Van Nuys?
> >
> > I think it was mentioned in that really big thread where I had to get technical.
> >
> You mean in one of the deleted messages? I searched Van Nuys in the discussion and didn't find anything.
> ---------------------------------

No it wasn't deleted, post 14 (on the first page of the has GreenCine begun throttling thread)), where I posted the address on the return envelope is in Van Nuys. Discussion search probably just doesn't work well.

xiaoxiao
post #12  on July 21, 2007 - 7:47 PM PDT  
> On July 21, 2007 - 12:21 PM PDT FGaipa wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> Conceivably this shift could benefit a majority of subscribers. But for Bay Area members it can only result in a substantial decline in service. I work for the USPS in Oakland. Figure two days each direction if you're very very lucky, up to a week either way if you're not. Consider also the likely responsiveness of underpaid processing center workers and managers at several hundred miles remove from their SF-based client. The fact, too often repeated in the throttling thread, that the new group handles a number of mail clients is not a plus. If you've been watching six or seven a week on a four-out, forget it.
>
> I've never tried Netflix, and wonder whether anyone can tell me here whether they really do still throttle and whether they might be a better source for our red, orange, and yellows. The fact that they mail and receive from San Jose, and that the Post Office treats them with kid gloves, special holdouts and signage, the works, suddenly looks relevant.
>
> fg
> ---------------------------------

I've been a user of Netflix on and off from the second year they were on business, three years ago. I've never had any problem with them and the delivery even improved after they lost the lawsuit last year. By the way, I live in the Bay Area and I noticed that the DVD I received today were marked Sta Clarita.
My rental history says that they mailed two DVD's on the 18th but the postmark on one which is legible says July 19, and I only received them today, the 21st. Normally I would have received it one day after they mailed it (July 19). With Netflix, I've never had any week that I did not get any DVD (even on a 1 at time subscription). The funny thing about the third DVD I was supposed to get today is that I saw they posted that they received it today. This is the DVD I complained about when I saw it in my queue that they mailed it to me on the 18th when I was only asking why it doesn't show that they already received it. How come they say I returned it and they received it today. I think they are manipulating my rental history records.

After I complained about seeing no shipment for the last five days they credited me with $8.00. I thought that was a little bit more than I deserved but now I see that they will probably owe me more if they are deliberately throttling delivery. I hope they are more intelligent than what they are doing now. There is no reason for them to transfer the mailing center so far away.

Also with Netflix, they have a lot more copies and they will tell you whether it is available, a short wait or a long wait. With GreenCine, most of my requests are colored red, orange, and yellow. Some blue here with Greencine remain blue for more than two months. And I've read in some older blogs here that this person had been waiting for some DVD for two years. The DVD's I want to rent that are shown in green are those which are Kung Fu, Japanese, obscure movies. One reason I am with GreenCine is that they say they work on Saturdays ( but I do not see them mailing anything on Saturdays). Also, they have uncensored, NC-17 or adult movies.
woozy
post #13  on July 21, 2007 - 9:52 PM PDT  
> On July 21, 2007 - 7:47 PM PDT xiaoxiao wrote:
> ---------------------------------
>> One reason I am with GreenCine is that they say they work on Saturdays ( but I do not see them mailing anything on Saturdays).

Well, they have to recieve something on Saturday to mail something on saturday. I've frequently seen things mailed on saturday. But that's not *that* big of a plus.


> Also, they have uncensored, NC-17 or adult movies.
> ---------------------------------

Netflix, unlike Blockbuster (unless they've changed their policies in the last ten years which they probably have), has NC-17 and uncensored movies. What they don't have is "adult" movies. Basically the icky stuff and the stuff in the back room with the smell.

"Henry and June", "Last Temptation of Christ" and their ilk are aplenty and Netflix.
FGaipa
post #14  on July 22, 2007 - 12:44 PM PDT  
> I searched Van Nuys in the discussion and didn't find anything.
> ---------------------------------

Check the address on your next return:

GreenCine.com
P.O. Box 8469
Van Nuys, CA 91409-8469.

Express mailing one ounce overnight to Van Nuys costs $16.25. Overnight 41 cent first class mail, what someone else here suggests, is a fluke if it happens at all. The number of handlings at each end within the Postal Service virtually prohibit overnight.

fg
woozy
post #15  on July 22, 2007 - 8:43 PM PDT  
> On July 21, 2007 - 6:12 PM PDT toastandkeri wrote:
> ---------------------------------
>> No it wasn't deleted, post 14 (on the first page of the has GreenCine begun throttling thread)), where I posted the address on the return envelope is in Van Nuys. Discussion search probably just doesn't work well.
>
Wow, don't know how I missed that. The search is okay but it does newest first and...
CarmenSF
post #16  on July 23, 2007 - 5:09 PM PDT  
I live in Los Angeles (moved down from SF last year) and use GreenCine. Movies take a day of travel. If I mail a DVD back on Monday, it gets there on Wednesday and I get a new one Friday. When I lived in San Francisco, I would mail a DVD Monday, it got there Tuesday and I had a new one by Wednesday.

Currently, on the two-out-at-a-time plan, I see about six-seven movies a month. I'm still happy and wouldn't move to Netflix, even if it is faster.
MrMiscreant
post #17  on July 25, 2007 - 3:32 PM PDT  
> On July 23, 2007 - 5:09 PM PDT CarmenSF wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> I live in Los Angeles (moved down from SF last year) and use GreenCine. Movies take a day of travel. If I mail a DVD back on Monday, it gets there on Wednesday and I get a new one Friday. When I lived in San Francisco, I would mail a DVD Monday, it got there Tuesday and I had a new one by Wednesday.
>
> Currently, on the two-out-at-a-time plan, I see about six-seven movies a month. I'm still happy and wouldn't move to Netflix, even if it is faster.
> ---------------------------------

It seems like even with the location change delivery has gotten slower. From what you said your disks experienced 1 day in transit. Since you're now closer to the source you should begin to experience overnight delivery.

I, in OAKLAND on the other hand used to get overnight delivery and am now experience 2 days in transit. DVD I sent out on Saturday just got to Van Nuys today (Wed). So it looks like I'll be forced to upgrade from 2-out to 4-out if I want to retain my DVD frequency. I'm not too happy about that.

I could be wrong but it always seemed to me that GC membership clustered closer to the Bay Area. I wonder if this moves actually improves most people's transit time enough to be worth it or is this a way to encourage the expansion of the their customer base throughout the country.
woozy
post #18  on July 25, 2007 - 11:08 PM PDT  
> On July 25, 2007 - 3:32 PM PDT MrMiscreant wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> It seems like even with the location change delivery has gotten slower. From what you said your disks experienced 1 day in transit. Since you're now closer to the source you should begin to experience overnight delivery.
>

They said they're still having trouble the the transition. I have no idea whats involved but they must physically move the inventory while lots of it still straggles in with the old SF addresses. They have to relocated the computer system and train people to their systems. The fact that it has slowed down for *everyone* including those in Texas and those in LA who are *closer* to the new center, just confirms the transition trouble.

Let's give them a chance to get the kinks out before we try to reach conclussions.

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