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GreenCine Tech Talk
Hardware, Software, Tech.
The nuts and bolts of movie making, home theater, and DVD.
76

Linux
Topic by: Battie
Posted: July 21, 2007 - 11:50 AM PDT
Last Reply: December 4, 2007 - 7:19 PM PST

page  1  2  3  4  5      prev | next
author topic: Linux
hamano
post #61  on October 12, 2007 - 5:13 AM PDT  
> On October 12, 2007 - 12:04 AM PDT Battie wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> Me: "Oh s***."
>
> So I follow the sound of the crying, hoping it was some other mama cat's kittens somewhere else. But, no. She'd HAD one kitten (at least two more to go, judging by her belly) behind some wood leaning against the fence. >_< I feel really bad. It was probably crying out of hunger and sheer COLD (probably 60-73 degrees outside now). (This does not bode well for the new kittens.)
>
> Right about the time I find the kitten, the flashlight batteries go (I'm so getting a new flashlight after this! It eats batteries like mad). So I turn around, and there's...

In a movie this is usually the cue for a blackout. In the next scene you're naked and tied to a chair in the back of a moving truck or something, heading god knows where...


Battie
post #62  on October 12, 2007 - 11:05 AM PDT  
> On October 12, 2007 - 5:13 AM PDT hamano wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> In a movie this is usually the cue for a blackout. In the next scene you're naked and tied to a chair in the back of a moving truck or something, heading god knows where...
> ---------------------------------

Why naked? Can't I be clothed?
hamano
post #63  on October 12, 2007 - 11:44 AM PDT  
> On October 12, 2007 - 11:05 AM PDT Battie wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> Why naked? Can't I be clothed?

The way movie logic works, if you'd prefer to be clothed you'll wake up naked, and if you prefer to be naked you'll wake up clothed. Either way you end up being excavated from a construction site or fished out of a river after the opening credits, and the FBI agent who is going to be the main character shows up during the autopsy.
Battie
post #64  on October 12, 2007 - 12:36 PM PDT  
> On October 12, 2007 - 11:44 AM PDT hamano wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> The way movie logic works, if you'd prefer to be clothed you'll wake up naked, and if you prefer to be naked you'll wake up clothed. Either way you end up being excavated from a construction site or fished out of a river after the opening credits, and the FBI agent who is going to be the main character shows up during the autopsy.
> ---------------------------------

Who wants to wake up naked after being kidnapped? Are we talking about some fantasy-sex-game-gone-bad plot now?



*No more kittens, even though she still has a few to go. I'm a little worried. She doesn't seem to be in distress or having any more contractions, but she should've finished delivering by now. >_> (I let her out of the cage, she ate, drank some water, went to the bathroom, then walked around for a bit like nothing was going on before returning to the cage voluntarily.)
Battie
post #65  on October 12, 2007 - 1:24 PM PDT  
I called some vets...no one has any pay plan, so the mama cat can't be seen. I finally did see her have a contraction and strain, but no kitten. She needs, according to various places, an 'emergency c-section.' One place quoted $300. >_> They said they'd hold a check for half the amount, but it still won't mean I'll have the money.

Why is it the SPCA will rescue abused animals, but doesn't know of a single clinic that can help a dying cat for cheap or free? >_<

Anyway, I still have a few places to call.
Battie
post #66  on October 12, 2007 - 2:11 PM PDT  
Heh, I'm mad now. I was calling another vet when I checked on her again. She'd finally popped out a kitten. A tabby like one of her last. >_> Stupid cat worried me. >:|

I am viciously hungry. I forgot to eat. :P


Is anyone running Vista right now? Does Intel really pwn AMD in the dual-core battle?
Catullus
post #67  on October 12, 2007 - 2:35 PM PDT  
Dual cores? PFFFFFFFT quad cores are on the way, oh and Intel quad cores are FAAAAAAAAKE.

Amd is going to have an advantage in certain areas for awhile at least until Intel releases some real quad cores which I know they plan to.
Battie
post #68  on October 12, 2007 - 4:11 PM PDT  
> On October 12, 2007 - 2:35 PM PDT Catullus wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> Dual cores? PFFFFFFFT quad cores are on the way, oh and Intel quad cores are FAAAAAAAAKE.
>
> Amd is going to have an advantage in certain areas for awhile at least until Intel releases some real quad cores which I know they plan to.
> ---------------------------------

Okay, just for discussion's sake...Does Intel really have an edge on AMD in dual-cores? Why? How? Etc?
Catullus
post #69  on October 12, 2007 - 10:10 PM PDT  
intel has an advantage right now in performance because they are using fake quad cores which are 2x dual cores on one die instead of a real quad core.

Intels price/performance advantage is negligible at best and really varies at different times, really comes down to who dropped the price last.

High end intel wins, mid range Id go with AMD most often because the price/performance ratio is probably better.

Really depends on budget, the prices at the time of purchase and the usage the CPU is going to be seeing.

I built a pc this summer and went with an amd5600 at the time because intels best processors were fake quadcores and the only one reasonably priced was there q6600 which actually sucks. I went with the 5600 becuase its price had JUST dropped when I bought it and compared to the 6000+ it creates lower heat and is also a 65NM processor compared to the 90NM that the 6000 is.

As for games I threw that and a evga superclocked 320MB 8800GTS with 2x1GB cas 4 Gskill ram and I max all games on my 720P sharp aquos tv (1360x768)

Really is a great setup for me.

I haven't checked right now but then you haven't really set any parameters.
Battie
post #70  on October 12, 2007 - 10:45 PM PDT  
> On October 12, 2007 - 10:10 PM PDT Catullus wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> intel has an advantage right now in performance because they are using fake quad cores which are 2x dual cores on one die instead of a real quad core.
>
> Intels price/performance advantage is negligible at best and really varies at different times, really comes down to who dropped the price last.
>
> High end intel wins, mid range Id go with AMD most often because the price/performance ratio is probably better.
>
> Really depends on budget, the prices at the time of purchase and the usage the CPU is going to be seeing.
>
> I built a pc this summer and went with an amd5600 at the time because intels best processors were fake quadcores and the only one reasonably priced was there q6600 which actually sucks. I went with the 5600 becuase its price had JUST dropped when I bought it and compared to the 6000+ it creates lower heat and is also a 65NM processor compared to the 90NM that the 6000 is.
>
> As for games I threw that and a evga superclocked 320MB 8800GTS with 2x1GB cas 4 Gskill ram and I max all games on my 720P sharp aquos tv (1360x768)
>
> Really is a great setup for me.
>
> I haven't checked right now but then you haven't really set any parameters.
> ---------------------------------

Simple parameters: lowest price available, fairly good products, something that'll keep up with the tech for at least 3-5 years. (Probably more like 3-4.)

I was thinking an AMD dual-core (4800+ or better), 1gb ram (upgrade to 2 later), 256-512mb vid card (depending on price). I'd be playing some games on it (mostly things like Age of Mythology, Civilization, etc), but probably nothing like Bioshock. Then again, you never know. :)
Cugat
post #71  on October 13, 2007 - 11:30 AM PDT  
On October 12, 2007 - 10:45 PM PDT Battie wrote:
> On October 12, 2007 - 10:10 PM PDT Catullus wrote:
> > intel has an advantage right now in performance because they are using fake quad cores which are 2x dual cores on one die instead of a real quad core.

Its not fake, its just clumsy. Kinda underlines the waste of money/time I-tanic was.

> > High end intel wins, mid range Id go with AMD most often because the price/performance ratio is probably better.

I'm an AMD fan, partially because I still can't make my Intel webcam work after 5 years. :-)

But theres also the economic history, and the decently focused tech development that has lead to better multicore designs and the 64 bit instruction set that actually hit a wide market (and a few other little things I imagine).

> > I built a pc this summer and went with an amd5600 at the time because intels best processors were fake quadcores and the only one reasonably priced was there q6600 which actually sucks. I went with the 5600 becuase its price had JUST dropped when I bought it and compared to the 6000+ it creates lower heat and is also a 65NM processor compared to the 90NM that the 6000 is.

Lower heat and smaller fabrication process tend to go hand in hand.

> > As for games I threw that and a evga superclocked 320MB 8800GTS with 2x1GB cas 4 Gskill ram and I max all games on my 720P sharp aquos tv (1360x768)

I'm still not sold on the 8000 series yet, ridiculously flexible, but I assume that comes at an efficiency price.

I wouldn't touch the 5000 series (not refined enough), I use a 6600 (midrange 6000 series). I don't use it much (Secondlife is held back by my CPU), but it tends to do well nonetheless (all the pretty screensavers, that tend to drive my backlight against a black screen...). 7000 series should be fine too, costs more for some reason though. :-)

I know very little about ATI's stuff, outside of a threat that in the distantish future it might have a decent free driver for them (thank AMD for that, when something materializes).

> I was thinking an AMD dual-core (4800+ or better), 1gb ram (upgrade to 2 later), 256-512mb vid card (depending on price). I'd be playing some games on it (mostly things like Age of Mythology, Civilization, etc), but probably nothing like Bioshock. Then again, you never know. :)

I try not to measure a graphics card by the RAM on it, the graphics processor is where the speed comes from. (low ram can cause texture blurriness though)
Cugat
post #72  on October 13, 2007 - 11:48 AM PDT  
On September 22, 2007 - 8:50 PM PDT woozy wrote:
> .Sigh.
>
> Hi Battie, Hi Cugat.
>
> Do either of you know anything about TCP ports and web hosting services and VPS?

Yes, some, and just what I read from Wikipedia.

> I wrote a really cute little on-line game application and it never occured to me my web hosting service wouldn't allow me to run it. It makes sense that I can't configure a server to open ports on a server I shared with others and only pay a medium ammount for. But, sheesh, they don't have to act like I asked for them to chop up an elephant and serve it with vinegar. I mean billions of web sites have server apps, why should I assume this is way above and beyond the call for vanilla hosting services?

In the name of overall security I can see them giving any code that isn't their own an evil eye.

Unless each server is hosting a whole lot of websites on one IP address I'm not sure why opening a high port (low ones need root) on its own is a big deal.

Really vanilla services really just expect you to drop some files and lightly scripted webpages that few will actually visit and then keep paying for hosting. If they have to answer unusual questions, you're rocking their boat. :-)

> So someone suggest I get VPS for about $20 a month. I'm currently paying $14.95. To get a dedicated server, it'd be $174.95 a month.

Hmm, cheap (on the virtual server). I kinda wonder what hitches are in that deal.

A dedicated server (should be at least, dunno what your server app is doing) is horrifically overkill for a cute little online game, depending on the user count.

> Sigh. I miss my university job days where the server was a huge honkin' machine just sitting there and I could do whatever I wanted directly on it.

Hehe.
Cugat
post #73  on October 13, 2007 - 12:21 PM PDT  
On September 17, 2007 - 7:16 AM PDT Battie wrote:
> I am becoming increasingly dissatisfied and actually quite angry with Ubuntu.

The unreasonably happy people standing in a circle holding hands will do horrible things to you if they catch you talking like that!

> #2: Still no help from Ubuntu's forums on my sound issue.

Was really fun trying to chat in #debian about a tech problem with the rude person who liked playing with his huge spammy bot swarm (acting stupidly in unison).

> #3: Part of my frustration with my 450mhz processor was that it couldn't handle .mkv files. Apparently, neither can Ubuntu. Whenever I play them in VLC (the least heavy-on-processor/ram video player), it skips entire frames, even with VLC at Very High Priority. In Totem, I get jerkiness and some weird green in the background. Possibly a video driver problem, but I don't care. I never had a problem in XP like this.

VLC is also available in Linux.

> #4: Uses large amounts of Virtual Memory that puts XP to shame. Even XP running under Style XP.

Find out what in particular is (in "top" hit "m"), go from there.

> #5: Whenever downloading a large file in IRC, I have problems. xChat will freeze altogether, while mIRC under Wine does a damn good job of faking it. And it's not a download speed vs. save speed issue as it happens pretty much as soon as the download begins, before it even has time to hit speeds over 20 KB/s.

Hmm, I've had complaints about xChat myself.

> #6: uTorrent, which still beats out Linux's competing torrent clients for its light resource usage, now has a drag-and-drop problem, which is my fault. In other words, I can't. But no matter how many times I uninstall Wine, delete Wine folders, etc...the problem will not correct itself.

There are torrent clients that are purely console based, but those don't have drag and drop either.

> #7: Winrar will not install under Wine. And frankly, the Ubuntu unrar program sucks beyond belief thanks to how long it takes to read an archive and/or extract a file.

I've gone through great pain to not even try unrar.

I think 7zip in WINE does unRARing, not sure if its any better though.

> #8: Still no Microsoft Reader.

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=49232 ?

> #9: Open Office still sucks mightly, even under a 2.7ghz processor.

Low memory, Open Office is the proverbial slothly hedonist floating around in a pool of RAM and harddrive space.

AbiWord kinda sucks though.

> #10: Give me some time, I'll find another problem.

"Boom tomorrow. There's always a boom tomorrow."

> And anyone who thinks Linux still blows Windows away can bite me. :) Maybe in another 2-5 years it might actually be ready for public use, but for now...it's just for OS snobs. (No offense, you OS snobs. XD)

Everything blows everything else away, for some reason or another.

> *sigh* I hate installing Windows.

Well, thats what pushed me over the edge to Linux.
Battie
post #74  on October 13, 2007 - 3:08 PM PDT  
> On October 13, 2007 - 12:21 PM PDT Cugat wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> The unreasonably happy people standing in a circle holding hands will do horrible things to you if they catch you talking like that!
>

I have sharp objects. They can bring it on. XD

> VLC is also available in Linux.
>

Which is the VLC I was talking about, lol. Or are you making a distinction between Ubuntu and Linux?

> Find out what in particular is (in "top" hit "m"), go from there.
>

I was talking about Ubuntu bits. gnome-panel, nautilus, trashapplet. I could take of the last, but it won't help when nautilus gets all funky. Sometimes metacity, too.

>
> There are torrent clients that are purely console based, but those don't have drag and drop either.
>

I've tried several GUI torrent apps in Ubuntu. They seem to have a common problem. Once the speeds hit a certain point, my system starts to slow. A lot. uTorrent doesn't do that. I eventually just worked around it. Made a torrent folder for uTorrent to automatically load on start-up. Still annoying though.

>
> I've gone through great pain to not even try unrar.
>

Ha!

>
> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=49232 ?
>

I'm aware of the work-around, but the last time I tried to figure it out, I got frustrated and gave up. I'm currently working on freeing up another 25GB of space on my 160gb so I can install a Windows OS on this HD after backing up Ubuntu (then recover whatever I can on the 80gb, move it to cds and 160gb, etc etc).

>
> Low memory, Open Office is the proverbial slothly hedonist floating around in a pool of RAM and harddrive space.
>

Never had that problem with Office. *sneers*

> Everything blows everything else away, for some reason or another.
>

Not really. My smoked hamburgers blow away McDonald's crappy soy burgers any day. It's about quality and ingredients. In the case of Linux vs. Windows, it's about functionality. Windows may be less secure (which can be mostly fixed with patches, firewall, etc) and it may not have all the seriously cool FREE programs, but there's nothing I can't do on it. Well, I guess there are exceptions. I can't write my own OS with it, obviously.

>
> Well, thats what pushed me over the edge to Linux.
> ---------------------------------

In that, I do not blame you.
Battie
post #75  on October 13, 2007 - 3:12 PM PDT  
Oh..not that anyone cares, but she had three kittens. Two Siamese (one is darker than the other) and one striped-tabby-ish kitten. My brother will take one kitten, so we only have to find homes for two. Given that at least one of the two will be Siamese, it shouldn't be hard. December = spaying time. >_>
Catullus
post #76  on October 13, 2007 - 5:30 PM PDT  
> On October 13, 2007 - 11:30 AM PDT Cugat wrote:
> ---------------------------------
>
> Its not fake, its just clumsy. Kinda underlines the waste of money/time I-tanic was.
>
> But theres also the economic history, and the decently focused tech development that has lead to better multicore designs and the 64 bit instruction set that actually hit a wide market (and a few other little things I imagine).
>
> Lower heat and smaller fabrication process tend to go hand in hand.
>
> I'm still not sold on the 8000 series yet, ridiculously flexible, but I assume that comes at an efficiency price.
>
> I wouldn't touch the 5000 series (not refined enough), I use a 6600 (midrange 6000 series). I don't use it much (Secondlife is held back by my CPU), but it tends to do well nonetheless (all the pretty screensavers, that tend to drive my backlight against a black screen...). 7000 series should be fine too, costs more for some reason though. :-)
>
> I know very little about ATI's stuff, outside of a threat that in the distantish future it might have a decent free driver for them (thank AMD for that, when something materializes).

>
> I try not to measure a graphics card by the RAM on it, the graphics processor is where the speed comes from. (low ram can cause texture blurriness though)
> ---------------------------------

ok you are showing a lot of ignorance here

1) of course lower power consumption causes less heat you know that and I know that but battie does not know that im sure :P

But saying the 5600+ produces less heat and requires less power than the 6000+ does not necessarily mean they are on different size chips thats why I added that in there, even if they were both 65NM or 90NM the 5600 would STILL produce less heat and use less energy because its not producing as many clock cycles. That difference would be a lot less had they both been the same size. Obviously then this information is not repetitive that it produces less heat because of the smaller size, it would anyway, these are two separate but relevant/related issues.

2) Intels quadcores are not true quadcores thus they are fake, I dont care to argue semantics but 2x dual core processors does not equal a true quadcore processor as a true quadcore processor is going to destroy the **** out of a fake quadcore processor performance wise. If you say otherwise I will secretly think you are an idiot and we can both be on our way... Fake quadcore is fake. KKTHX

3) you obviously do not game, second life aside a 6000 series wont play new games coming out this year... you trying playing a game like assasins creed or gears of war for pc (both yet to be released but are coming out soon) and your pc will choke and die even if your processor was great.

as for the 8000 series... anything below the card i got in the 8000 series sucks for gaming, the 7600GT/GS or 79XXgt/s series are better options than the 8600GT/s cards. My card now? its sick, AMD/ATI options to say the least suck performance wise... the only option if you are a gamer is to get an Nvidia Card at this time because ATI/AMD is non competitive and Nvidia is really only competing with themselves. Oh and the 8800GTS is really big and heats up my room nicely (but its oh so powerful)

4) ram doesn't matter on a graphics card unless you dont have enough of it... in which case it matters a ****ing ton thanks though... as for the reason why I got my card? I have a 720P tv which at gaming at 1360x768 resolution uses up a good chunk of that ram... if i were gaming on a 1080P tv at 1920x1080 my videocard would chug like a mofo unless I got the 8800GTS 640MB edition which is the same exact everything on my card except double ram.

Point being is that if you are going to game at high resolution your video card will be bottlenecked if you dont have enough ram and that will be the MAIN thing holding you back... yes you can have a **** card with 512MB of ram on it and it doesn't matter anyway, but if you have a fast card like me and you are going to be maxing out your card you need enough ram to cover it. There is a reason the 8800GTX ultra has 768MB on it, because it NEEDS it to max out current and near future games.
Catullus
post #77  on October 13, 2007 - 5:36 PM PDT  
as to some of batties issues

7zip like he said is a great alternative to winrar, i use both

and hydrairc is better than mirc by lightyears see if you can install that under wine... i dont know about xchat ive been using hydrairc for years now and dont have a need to switch

when you are ready to buy a computer ill help you pick out parts

Civilization is really easy to run as is the other games you mentioned... You know bioshock isn't that resource hungry, assuming you weren't running vista and had a gig of ram and an ok GPU (a less than 100$ card even will run it) if you spent 80~150$ on a grahics card you would be able to run all the games out now easily at decent settings and get a decent framerate... for 3 years in the future youd have to upgrade at some point of course. My card is going to be needing an upgrade in 3 years and I just dropped 300$ on it in august.
Battie
post #78  on October 14, 2007 - 12:40 AM PDT  
> On October 13, 2007 - 5:30 PM PDT Catullus wrote:
> ---------------------------------
> 1) of course lower power consumption causes less heat you know that and I know that but battie does not know that im sure :P
> ---------------------------------

...I'm blonde, not mentally retarded. >_> And I do know about the new 'energy efficient' cpus. ._.

> as to some of batties issues
>
> when you are ready to buy a computer ill help you pick out parts
>

I already have parts under consideration. The only thing I don't know enough about is video cards.

> Civilization is really easy to run as is the other games you mentioned... You know bioshock isn't that resource hungry, assuming you weren't running vista and had a gig of ram and an ok GPU (a less than 100$ card even will run it) if you spent 80~150$ on a grahics card you would be able to run all the games out now easily at decent settings and get a decent framerate... for 3 years in the future youd have to upgrade at some point of course. My card is going to be needing an upgrade in 3 years and I just dropped 300$ on it in august.
> ---------------------------------

I know Civ, etc is okay to run on a standard machine (by today's standards, I mean). I could *possibbly* run it on this computer (not the latest AoE game but the older ones).

As for upgrades, since I'm not a huge gamer, three years would probably work for me, media and internet wise. The graphics card would probably need to be updated after a while if I bought a new game, but otherwise...it'd just be programs I'd need to worry over.
Catullus
post #79  on October 14, 2007 - 11:27 AM PDT  
well if you need help picking out a videocard let me know then, basically what you would get would depend on how much you want to spend on it, and your other parts.

some options that are viable at the moment from lowest to highest price in your range

7600GT

8600GT

x1950

Geforce 7900GS are good options but they are hard to find now paying more than 150$ for one would be a mistake anyway, there are no good midrange cards out now that are in the low 200$ range once you get past 150$ theres nothing good til like 280$ worth purchasing anyway.



Battie
post #80  on October 18, 2007 - 1:48 AM PDT  
So one kitten disappeared Sunday night (we suspect Stormy killed it by accident, then ate it), then Stormy accidentally killed a second. She bit down too hard while carrying it and I couldn't get it to eat afterwards, not even with a rag and formula. She lost her mommy rights over that. She now has supervised visitation only. The remaining kitten is being kept inside.

And it is a cutesy. It sucks on its paw when going to sleep, and fusses mightily at its mama when she cleans it. It's doing pretty well. I think the kitten's eyes will open early given that one already looks like it's starting to slit.

I have poison ivy from one of the cats. *growls* The back of one hand and both forearms. I suspect Freckle.


ON the Windows end...I think I'll probably install Windows this weekend, after backing up Linux and before jury duty Tuesday. *growls*
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